End of Year

My God Can Do ANYTHING!

It is very unsettling when I hear someone say, “God can do anything.” Is this truly the case? If that is so, then you serve an illogical god that does not exist. Sorry to burst your bubble, but if you want to serve the one true God of the Bible, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, then you are going to have to change your thoughts about who He is.

Clearly the God of the Bible cannot do everything! He says Himself that He cannot lie. Yes God is omnipotent (all-powerful), he is omnipresent (all places at one time), omniscient (all knowing) and omnibenevolent (all good), but these attributes do not mean that he can do “anything.” We should be careful not to say or teach what God is not because every wrong belief you have about God has a consequence. If you say “God is all loving.” but do not balance that with the fact that God is also “just,” you will be disappointed.

Unbelievers love to hear Christ followers say, “My God can do anything,” because for some reason they love to ask, “Well, can your God build a rock so big that He can’t lift it?” In their foolishness, the Christian has said something that is not true, and the unbeliever attempts to justify His unbelief by asking a question of a god that does not exist. You see, that question is illogical, so to that question I typically respond: “Yes, god can build a rock so big he can’t lift it.” The unbeliever believes that he has trapped you, but all he has done is shown himself that he doesn’t believe in made-up gods either. You see, logic is a reflection of the way God thinks. We could not even have the laws of logic if it were not for the God of the Bible. So if the unbeliever wants to believe in a god that is logically impossible, then yes, that god could build a rock so big that he can’t lift it. You see as long as you are not going to believe in logic, then you might as well have an illogical god. Just remember, when we serve other gods, we are not serving gods, we are serving idols. (1 Chronicles 16:26 and Psalms 96:5)

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Leave30 Responses to testMy God Can Do ANYTHING!

  1. Jay Liverstitch August 30, 2010 at 7:33 am #

    There’s that claim again (the one that you denied having made just a week ago).

    Eric says “We could not even have the laws of logic if it were not for the God of the Bible.”

    I’m still waiting for some substantiation of this claim. Even if you can not prove this claim, I would at least like some evidence to back it up. So yet again, why don’t you pick, lets say, the 4 most common non-christian worldviews and show why those 4 worldviews can not account for laws of logic.

    Those 4 are as follows:

    -Islam
    -Hinduism
    -Nonreligious
    -Buddhism

    I understand that you could not possibly go through all possible worldviews and debunk each one (after all, there are infinite possibilities). But it should be rather easy to debunk these 4, given that you claim access to a being who is all-knowing.

    Jay

  2. Jay Liverstitch August 30, 2010 at 9:15 am #

    I’d like to take a post to point out something that keeps bugging me about the posts Eric and many other believers are making here.

    There are several statements that many believers are conflating, when in fact they are quite different. Read the following statements and think about them before moving to the next.

    – There is no ultimate truth.

    – We can not discover ultimate truth.

    – We can not be certain that we’ve discovered ultimate truth.

    Note that only the 3rd statement is consistently made by us skeptics. In fact, I don’t recall having ever actually heard anyone make the first two statements on this blog or any other (apart from some postmodern philosophers). Despite this fact, it’s the first statement that I consistently hear Eric and others attacking, even though nobody here apparently holds to it.

    So most, if not all of us here agree that the first two statements are false. I maintain that the universe operates in discernible patterns, and that these patterns can be discovered and understood. Many of them, I believe we have already discovered, at least in part. I think you would agree with this. The only part we disagree on, in terms of philosophy, is whether each of us can be certain that we are correct once we’ve discovered these truths.

    Also note that in this statement, there are basically two parts; the part about truth (or reality), and the part about certainty. The second part, certainty, the part that Eric is spends his time emphasizing, is rather meaningless. I don’t really care how certain you are on anything; I only care how correct you are on that thing. It is possible to be certain and wrong, certain and right, uncertain and wrong, or uncertain and right. So ultimately, certainty has no bearing on actually discovering or knowing truth.

    It’s here that the presup argument fails with me. When we say that you can not be certain that you are correct it’s because you’ve given us no reason to believe that you have any more insights, or senses available to you that we do not. You usually respond with “are you certain about that.” While I might not be certain, without some reason to believe you, why should I? If you want me to believe that you have access to an omniscient, omnipotent being, then show me something that only a more powerful being could show me. Read my thoughts at this moment or call fire from heaven to consume a sacrifice. I’ll even settle for something non-supernatural. Ask God to reveal some scientific truth that humanity doesn’t currently understand, e.g. give us the theory that will unify General Relativity with Quantum Mechanics, and then show us that it’s true through some experimentation.

    Any of the above should be easy for an omnipotent being, yet what we get from you instead is circular rhetoric, blind assertions, and empty claims to certainty, none of which you choose to support with evidence. I say again, God could do better than this.

    If this bag of tricks is all your God has equipped you with to bring us to him, then I can only reach 1 of 2 conclusions:

    1) God is not all powerful, not very intelligent, and doesn’t really care if I ever come to know him, or

    2) God doesn’t really exist, and you are simply looking for a rhetorical “GOTCHA!” that can help you avoid having to formulate any substantive argument or evidence for Him.

    Like the movie The Matrix. You say you know Kung-Fu, and all I ask is “Show me.”

    Jay

  3. Jon Richt August 30, 2010 at 9:24 am #

    I would applaud this interpretation of omnipotence but for one small issue: not being able to lie means God is not all-powerful.

    People throw the word around too easily. However, if I am able to do something that the Christian God can not do, clearly I am more powerful than he is, even if in a very small & insignificant way. And that makes him less than omnipotent.

    IRT the notion of this deity being illogical, you should note (Eric) that omniscience and omnipotence can not exist logically in the same being. Being omniscient, God can see the date when Jesus will return to the Earth. Can he then change that date? If you say ‘yes’, then He is not omniscient because he would have forseen this; if you say ‘no’, then clearly he is not omnipotent.

    I applaud any attempt to make the God you worship sound reasonable. Although you and I would disagree about this, I’m confident that it’s the nonsensical explanations of this deity that drive so many people away from religious faith.

    “it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn” (St Augustine)

  4. Joakim Rosqvist August 30, 2010 at 10:16 am #

    Can your god create all the life-forms presently on Earth by first making one simple life-from and then letting it multiply and diversify through the principles outlined in the theory of evolution?

  5. David Ray August 30, 2010 at 12:11 pm #

    Eric says, “He says Himself that He cannot lie.”

    False = 1st Kings 22:22-23 – And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persude him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.

    True = Numbers 23:19 – God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent.

    False = 2nd Chronicles 18:22 – Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil against thee.

    True = 1 Samuel 15:29 – The Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent.

    False = Jeremiah 20:7 – O LORD, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived; thou art stronger than I, and hast prevailed: I am in derision daily, every one mocketh me.

    True = 2 Samuel 7:28 – Thou art that God, and thy words be true.

    False = Ezekiel 14:9 – And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel.

    True = Titus 1:2 – In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began.

    False = 2nd Thesselonians 2:11-12 – And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

    True = Hebrews 6:18 – It was impossible for God to lie.

    The “big book of multiple choice” strikes again.
    Step 1: Figure out what you want God to say.
    Step 2: Find appropriate bible verse to support step 1:
    Step 3: Repeat

    If God knows all and wants us to be saved by way of His Word, why is He such a terrible author?
    ====================================
    Side note: to whoever is responsible for making sure comments get on the blog. Please make sure they get there. I’ve had many comments never make it with no explanation as to why (a simple e-mail would be nice). If they are being moderated away, it would be good to know why so that such mistakes can be avoided.
    Thanks.

  6. Jack Napper August 30, 2010 at 1:34 pm #

    “Yes God is omnipotent (all-powerful), he is omnipresent (all places at one time), omniscient (all knowing) and omnibenevolent (all good), but these attributes do not mean that he can do “anything.”

    What is it that the young people would say here? Oh, DICTIONARY FAIL! Not to mention a glaring contradiction to what you put in parenthesis.

    “Clearly the God of the Bible cannot do everything! He says Himself that He cannot lie.”

    Or he could be lying about is inability to lie.

    “Well, can your God build a rock so big that He can’t lift it?”

    This is a perfectly valid question. You dodging however, is not valid what-so-ever. And yet again we have baseless assertions you have yet to substantiate.

    This entry is yet another waste of space on the interwebnets

  7. Stephen Holshouser August 30, 2010 at 12:38 pm #

    Yes, it would be more accurate to say, “My God can do anything He wills.” Isaiah 46:9 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
    10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

    Although most men (even some nominal Christians) hate the thought of God being absolutely sovereign. For many, God is free to do what He wants unless it interferes with their own wills or their idea of right and wrong. Also see; Isaiah 14:24, Psalm 115:3, Psalm 135:6, Daniel 4:35, Ecc 3:14.

    Question; Could God turn the hearts of the skeptics to know Him as the Creator?

    thanks for the labors here!

  8. Stephen Holshouser August 31, 2010 at 12:18 am #

    Jon R., If we can fail, but God is unable to fail, does that make us more powerful than Him or make Him less than omnipotent? Of course not. It is only because it is not God’s will or nature to lie that He does not. Since it is not God’s nature or desire to lie or be unjust like us, that just means He is completely superior to us. Would my car be better than yours because mine breaks down all the time, but yours is unable to? Of course not.

    Also, God knows the date of Christ’s Second Coming because it is already finished as far as He is concerned. He lives outside of time. “Does God want to change the date?” would be a better question than “Can He change date?” He wouldn’t change it because it is already set for precisely the perfect time!

  9. Stephen Holshouser August 31, 2010 at 12:21 am #

    “Can God build a rock so big that He can’t lift it?”

    To preface; God does what He wills, when He wills, and only as He wills.
    The answer to the question is; No. He is unable to take part in an exercise in futility, which is what that would be. Just because God can’t take part in foolish things doesn’t make Him any less omnipotent, it just makes Him far superior to us. Saying God can’t do X, Y, or Z, doesn’t take away His Godhood, it just means that X, Y, and Z are either not in His nature, are against His will, or are not for His glory or for the ultimate good of His children. He can and has, however, built many rocks out of nothing at all, can evolution do that? If it can’t then where did they originate from?

  10. Leonard Ciciarelli August 30, 2010 at 11:22 pm #

    @Jay Liverstitch

    We could not even have the laws of logic if it were not for the God of the Bible. This is true because the God of the Bible is the One True God. The resurrection of Jesus Christ proves this.

  11. Stephen Holshouser August 31, 2010 at 12:24 am #

    David R. In 1 Kings and 2 Chronicles you may already know that God did send the truth to Ahab by Micaiah the prophet. It is the same for the passages in Ezekiel and 2 Thess; both include people that heard the truth and rejected it. God will and does give people over to a reprobate mind when they willfully reject what He says. God allowing people to be deceived does not make Him unjust. The word “deceive” is also translated “persuade” in other passages as well. However, Jeremiah, being a fallible man, may have misinterpreted what God said to him (as did some of the apostles concerning Christ’s earthly mission) in Jeremiah chapter 1. We often misunderstand what God says and Jeremiah may have simply expressed it in that way.

    I agree with you that you can make the Bible say whatever you want it to if you take it out of context. However, I don’t remember Him ever saying that it is His purpose or obligation to save every human being. But God is by no means a terrible author. Examine the prophecies in passages like Isaiah 53, Psalm 22 and Daniel 9, which Jesus fulfilled exactly as foretold hundreds of years later. These writings are confirmed as legitimate even in the secular world by the discovery of the Dead Sea scrolls. This is amazing literature with nothing else even on the same playing field!

    Why wouldn’t every person want every other person in the world to be a practicing Christian? Love your enemies, do good to all, help those that are in need, do unto others as you would have them do to you, no stealing, no hatred or lying, etc? Would there not be world peace? I fall miserably short of these things, but Jesus fulfilled it on my behalf. I would have no hope of ever being reconciled to God without His work and Him paying my sin debt. He is gracious to all that come to Him, even to those that have hated Him and despised His offer as I did in the past. Thanks for taking the time to read all this!

  12. Leonard Ciciarelli August 30, 2010 at 11:47 pm #

    @Jay Liverstitch

    In response to your 2nd post:

    Test John 7:17.

  13. Jack Napper August 31, 2010 at 11:22 am #

    @Leonard Ciciarelli

    “We could not even have the laws of logic if it were not for the God of the Bible. This is true because the God of the Bible is the One True God. The resurrection of Jesus Christ proves this.
    Yes it does by definition.”

    So here we have this assertion yet again along with a PROOF that cannot be substantiated outside of the bible.

    “He is unable to take part in an exercise in futility, which is what that would be.”

    God is unable?!?!?!?!?!

    “Just because God can’t take part in foolish things doesn’t make Him any less omnipotent, it just makes Him far superior to us.”

    “Saying God can’t do X, Y, or Z, doesn’t take away His Godhood, it just means that X, Y, and Z are either not in His nature, are against His will, or are not for His glory or for the ultimate good of His children.”

    If this were a lesser god of other mythologies then no. However, it’s obviously not the “God of the Bible” then is it?

    “He can and has, however, built many rocks out of nothing at all, can evolution do that? If it can’t then where did they originate from?”

    You’re mixing your sciences buddy.

    “Jon R., If we can fail, but God is unable to fail, does that make us more powerful than Him or make Him less than omnipotent? Of course not. It is only because it is not God’s will or nature to lie that He does not.”

    Can God fail? Isn’t there a biblical flood story…never mind. the problem is that your are arguing personality and choice as is they are the same as ability. Do you not see the flaw here?

  14. Jon Richt August 31, 2010 at 1:26 pm #

    Hi Stephen.

    In the context of this discussion, whether God wants to lift the rock or to change the date of the resurrection – is immaterial. We are talking specifically about abilities not desires (aka. omnipotence).

    I am often told that “God can not lie”; Eric Hovind has even done so above. This is quite different from “God does not want to lie”.

    Are you sure you and Eric are in agreement about God’s capabilities? It would seem to me that you’re not…

  15. Mike Ayala August 31, 2010 at 5:09 pm #

    Amen Eric,

    The illogical god they serve is one formed after their own image.

    It is critically important that when we answer critics we get our facts correct that we only speak in truth and love.

    On technical matters, it is right that critics scrutinize what we say and how we say it. If we are sloppy with the facts, then we blow our credibility and present a poor witness to Christ.

    The safest way to answer critics is to use the word of God. We can know absolutely and with all certainty that if we speak the word of God representing the Lord in truth, His word will do its work – both in us and in the person to whom it is spoken – whether exhortation to righteousness or conviction of sin.

    “Let us not weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart.”

    Know that as you with the word of God answer the critics who post here, whether they like it or not, the Holy Spirit is working in them. As iron sharpens iron, He is also using them to help us grow as Christians – something that probably would annoy them to no end if they understood it.

    God bless and protect you and your family,

    Mike Ayala

    To the philosophers:

    Philosophizing about whether or not God can do anything is useless unless one consults the word of God. The Lord reveals to us His nature through His word.

    As far as God being able to do anything, He can do anything according to His will and nature. God limits Himself by His righteousness and holiness.

    God is Righteous, something the natural man in his self-centered pride observing a cursed creation cannot fathom. Do not glory in your ability to lie. That is weakness. Real strength lies in being able to say no to sin and to walk in righteousness.

  16. Mike Ayala August 31, 2010 at 5:27 pm #

    Response to Jay Liverstitch

    Hi Jay

    One need not debunk other pagan religions when one can prove that the God of the Bible is our Creator. The question is whether or not you are willing to objectively consider the evidence God has provided you that you might reasonably come to that conclusion.

    It is bad form to deem and define some evidence as inadmissible in the court of your mind. To reject the Bible as valid evidence for the ultimate truth of God is self deception and blatant dishonesty borne out of fear. If the Bible is as corrupt or valueless as its critics claim, then they should only be too happy and ready to expose its error.

    Again, if it is certainty you want, look to the Word of God. Fulfilled prophecy found in the Bible is God’s unique way of providing you the certainty you seek. You can be certain that you have found ultimate truth when you look to Jesus because all the Scripture is written about Him, the word of God is packed with internal proofs of supernatural design by God, and it validates itself through fulfilled prophecy.

    This is one reason why and how we can trust the Genesis 1 account of creation. It is not just because evolution as taught by evolutionists is intellectually undefendable, but ever more so because we have reliable reporting from direct observation by the One who created creation which includes the laws of logic we enjoy and who makes your heart beat and gives you breath. He also likes to be appreciated for His kindness.

    I’m trying to discern whether you are making a fuss for fuss sake when you challenge Eric or if you are truly seeking ultimate truth. How will you know by your measure when you have found ultimate truth? All you have by which to measure anything is your own understanding which is limited at best. Have you defined out of existence the possibility of finding ultimate truth?

    What would it take to meet your threshhold of proof that you would then embrace the bible as the reliable truth? How certain does one need to be? Have you accepted anything in your life as reliable truth?

    God has provided the absolutely most highest standard of truth. If you cannot accept His divine revelation to you, then why do you accept evolution dogma as truth? Or do you?

    God is not concerned about the proofs for which you asked. Such is not His way. The devil told Jesus to jump from the pinnacle of the temple in Jerusalem that He might present Himself as Messiah of Israel in a macho-seductive way. The devil even quoted Scripture to support his request, but really, he misquoted it. The part the devil left out was, “to keep Thee in all Thy ways”.

    You have to approach God on His terms – not yours – though Jesus. He will speak to you about your sin and your need for the Savior. It is actually quite arrogant for you to demand the Creator of heaven and earth to metaphorically jump through hoops for you. He has already done more than you can imagine to bless you, and you are neither aware nor appreciative of it.

    Grace and blessings to you,

    Mike Ayala

  17. ben greer August 31, 2010 at 4:53 pm #

    I praise Jesus for A TRUE MIRACLE. For fifteen years I have had two herniated discs in L4-L5 that pinches my sciatic nerve,very painful.Doctors kept telling me I needed surgery.Last fall,it got so bad it was hard walking without a cain,and really,because of the pain, I just wanted to die.
    My wife and her church prayed over me,annointing me with oil and laying thier hands on me in The Name of Jesus.I experienced beautiful warmth,love and healing INSTANTLY!I layed my cane against the altar and walked away,even skipped a bit praising Jesus.Today,I walk without a cain and some days feel well enough to jog a short distance,Glory to God!

  18. Jon Richt September 1, 2010 at 7:22 am #

    God limits Himself by His righteousness and holiness.

    Then he is not omnipotent.

  19. Chris P September 1, 2010 at 8:41 am #

    You can build things out of nothing. This whole universe has zero total mass and zero total energy. It came out of quantum perturbations that created matching amounts of matter and anti-matter.

    Go watch Laurence Krauss explain it. Much better than the Bible version.

  20. Jack Napper September 1, 2010 at 12:14 pm #

    “It is bad form to deem and define some evidence as inadmissible in the court of your mind. To reject the Bible as valid evidence for the ultimate truth of God is self deception and blatant dishonesty borne out of fear.”

    It’s better to reject it based on what it is. To simply accept it because someone says it’s the word of God is not only a lead in to circular reasoning it’s just plain silly. When it can be shown to be wrong and require apologetics and logical fallacies to “prove it” and cannot be verified by third party sources or other evidence why should I accept it?

    Heck in one of his “Creation in Common Sense” videos Eric ask people should read the bible as if it were true in order for you to the believe that it’s true.

    “If the Bible is as corrupt or valueless as its critics claim, then they should only be too happy and ready to expose its error.”

    Been done. Find a new argument.

    “Again, if it is certainty you want, look to the Word of God.”

    CIRCULAR REASONING. If someone wants to know that the Bible is the ‘Word of God’ they should look to the ‘Word of God’.

    “Fulfilled prophecy found in the Bible is God’s unique way of providing you the certainty you seek. ”

    Most of what I hear is interpretation and nonsense from fear mongers about the end of days. Of course I can give you “Jesus returning in about 5 minutes” literature from back in the 70s. What about Isreal? It’s call a self-fulfilling prophecy. Here’s another; “ERIC HOVIND WILL MAKE YET ANOTHER BLOG ENTRY AS WILL HIS FATHER”. We already know that people are looking to the bible and trying to making the prophecies come true so they can then claim the bible was right.

    “You can be certain that you have found ultimate truth when you look to Jesus because all the Scripture is written about Him, the word of God is packed with internal proofs of supernatural design by God, and it validates itself through fulfilled prophecy.”

    Circular reasoning and no proof of these events occurring. We’re still waiting on evidence of a global flood that a that could easily be debunked by a 5 grader (if you’ve seen the show you’ll get the joke there).

    “This is one reason why and how we can trust the Genesis 1 account of creation. ”

    Really I must have missed it.

    “It is not just because evolution as taught by evolutionists is intellectually undefendable, but ever more so because we have reliable reporting from direct observation by the One who created creation which includes the laws of logic we enjoy and who makes your heart beat and gives you breath. He also likes to be appreciated for His kindness.”

    And more circular reasoning. You have yet to provide evidence as to the authority of the bible beyond more circular reasoning. Oh yeah and let’s not forget the non sequitor.

    “I’m trying to discern whether you are making a fuss for fuss sake when you challenge Eric or if you are truly seeking ultimate truth. How will you know by your measure when you have found ultimate truth? All you have by which to measure anything is your own understanding which is limited at best. Have you defined out of existence the possibility of finding ultimate truth? ”

    Believe those who seek the truth, doubt those who find it; doubt all, but do not doubt yourself. — Andre Gide

    “What would it take to meet your threshhold of proof that you would then embrace the bible as the reliable truth? How certain does one need to be? Have you accepted anything in your life as reliable truth?”

    What would it take? Apparently you missed where I’ve pointed out your fallacious arguments. That would be one. Outside evidence would be another. Finally the smoking gun. If it were indeed the word of God we would not see the splittering of faiths. there would be no need for apologetics and it would be undeniable be any.

    The rest is really just preachy nonsense and more fallacies. So I won’t waste my time with it or this post would get REEEEAAALLLY long.

  21. Stephen Holshouser September 1, 2010 at 1:02 pm #

    Hello Jack,

    “Your mixing your sciences buddy.”

    Fair enough, but I bet you knew what I meant. Where did the rock come from? Matter and energy cannot be created or destroyed, so Someone violated this law at some point, right?

    “you are arguing personality and choice as if they are the same as ability. Do you not see the flaw here?”

    I do see the point you are trying to make. However, I think the usage of the word “omnipotent” makes all the difference. The God of the Bible and Creation describes Himself like this;
    Isaiah 46:9-10 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me, Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

    What word would you use to describe the self-existing God, who can do anything He wants to and Won’t do anything He does not want to do? People, I believe, know what it means when we say “omnipotent”… it goes without saying that He can do ALL He wills, not “everything without exception.” I think your objection is based on your definition of “omnipotent,” which seems to be “able to do all things without exception.” I agree with you that there could not logically be such a being. The Bible only presents an Almighty God that does ONLY as He wills, and nothing else.

    When we debate over whether any being is “able to do all things without exception” you miss the bigger picture that there is a Person who has constructed the universe and all that is in it, including the atoms that you and I are made of. He is there to be known, Jack. You know, some of the greatest Christians were first staunch unbelievers… something to think about! SH

  22. Stephen Holshouser September 1, 2010 at 2:54 pm #

    Hi Jon,

    “God limits Himself by His righteousness and holiness.”

    That is close to being correct. He is Who He is, and only acts accordingly. Read my last post to Jack about the definition of “omnipotent.” If the Righteous Creator can and does ONLY & ALWAYS as He wills, what word would you use to describe Him besides “Almighty” or “omnipotent?” I know of no person ever of any religion that believes God can do anything at all- even things that go against His nature or character. The Bible says this;
    Psalm 135: 6 Whatsoever the LORD pleased, that did he in heaven, and in earth, in the seas, and all deep places.

    It doesn’t say “Whatsoever the Lord pleased and everything He didn’t please, that did he in heaven, and earth…” Don’t miss what the natural world around us and the Bible are shouting to us about the living Creator-God that knows what we are thinking and gives us life and breath. Knowing Him and Jesus Christ intimately is eternal life according to John 17:3. You have the invitation as a human being. “In His presence is fulness of joy…” What say you?

    “Are you sure you and Eric are in agreement about God’s capabilities?”

    I don’t know, but he makes the correct assertion that the God of the Bible can’t do all things without exception. This is perfectly harmonious with Who God is according to Scripture. SH

  23. Jack Napper September 1, 2010 at 3:18 pm #

    “Fair enough, but I bet you knew what I meant. Where did the rock come from? Matter and energy cannot be created or destroyed, so Someone violated this law at some point, right?”

    Yes a want and need to lump everything into a concept you refer to a EVOLUTIONISM. You then ask biolgists question about physics and when they can’t answer (or give you an answer you like) you go AHAAAA!!! It’s also the same reason that you grab anyone with a Ph.D. and stick them into one of your little videos. Here’s the funny thing…EVOLTUIONARY THEORY DOES NOT EXCLUDE GOD. In fact it make no reference to ‘where it all came from’ nor does it need do. This is a construct of your EVOLUTIONISM nonsense. Oddly enough you think that all persons who accept evolutionary theory as valid or all atheists should have all the answers. Thank you once again, as you all do, of shoing your ignorance of both.

    Second, thank you again for the high school science lesson. Perhaps one day you can move beyond it. Oh I see you like to pretend you’re at least on the same level as someone who claim to have taught high school science for 15 years (and apparently every discipline therein). You are forgetting that you must move beyond an isolated system.

    Lastly, look at the definition of Laws of Science. Of course you probably think, much like Eric that a theory is promoted to a law rather than a theory containing laws. You might also learn that laws a made to be broken and disproved. Kinda throws a giant kink in the “they obviously came from God” argument doesn’t it.

    “I do see the point you are trying to make. However, I think the usage of the word “omnipotent” makes all the difference.”

    Having unlimited or universal power, authority, or force; all-powerful

    Please explain where I got this wrong.

    “What word would you use to describe the self-existing God, who can do anything He wants to and Won’t do anything He does not want to do?”

    Again you present a flawed argument. This deity would still be omnipotent. The question is not whether He, She, It or They WIL or WOULD but CAN or COULD such a being do it. Apparently the problem is not with a defintion but with you comprehension of the question.

    “When we debate over whether any being is “able to do all things without exception” you miss the bigger picture that there is a Person who has constructed the universe and all that is in it, including the atoms that you and I are made of. He is there to be known, Jack. You know, some of the greatest Christians were first staunch unbelievers, something to think about! SH”

    And again we have another dodge.

  24. Jon Richt September 2, 2010 at 6:30 am #

    Stephen wrote the following: When we debate over whether any being is “able to do all things without exception” you miss the bigger picture that there is a Person who has constructed the universe and all that is in it

    I submit that it is *you* who are missing the point.

    Faithful Christians, when expressing reverence for the deity they believe in, often say patently ridiculous stuff. Although I take your point IRT looking at the underlying, common sense message rather than the nit-picky details, the issue is that these details are often used to justify / explain things. Can God flood the entire Earth? Yes, because he’s omnipotent. Can he know every thing that ever has been or ever will be known? Yes, because he’s omniscient.

    The bottom line is that Christians describe their deity as being fundamentally incoherent. He does not make sense, and rather than address this, Christians instead change from the logically inconsistent to the spiritually uplifting (aka. omnibenevolent”).

    Christians do not care whether what they’re saying about God makes sense or not. And that is the point. If you don’t care to express yourself coherently, why should non-believers take anything you say seriously?

  25. David Ray September 2, 2010 at 9:03 am #

    @ Stephen,

    Thank you for a thoughtful response. I don’t have time to cover all of the examples, so I’ll stick with the 1 Kings 22 verses. My reading suggests the following: Yes, the kings wanted to hear what they wanted to hear. However, that doesn’t change the fact that Micaiah was the ‘true’ prophet and supposedly was communicating the truth.

    Micaiah – “So now the Lord has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours.”

    What you are saying is, “God didn’t lie, he just made other people lie.” How is that any better?

    I still argue that God is a terrible author. Is He all-knowing? If so, then He knows how to write a book that everyone can understand. Is He all-powerful? If so, then He can write said book. Is He all-loving? If so, then he would want us to have such a book so that we could commune with him.

    No. Instead, we get a book full of apparent and real contradictions. Furthermore, I often hear that “if you really want to understand it, you need to read the original Greek and Hebrew.” See above paragraph. If He is all-knowing and all-powerful, he could write a book for all to read and understand.

  26. andrew Ryan September 2, 2010 at 9:55 am #

    If God cannot do something illogical, then God is subject to the laws of logic. How can God therefore also be their author?

  27. Jon Richt September 2, 2010 at 4:04 pm #

    Whateverman wrote the following: “Are you sure you and Eric are in agreement about God’s capabilities?”

    Stephen Holshouser responded: I don’t know, but he makes the correct assertion that the God of the Bible can’t do all things without exception. This is perfectly harmonious with Who God is according to Scripture.

    Stephen, scripture pretty much says God is omnipotent:

    “For nothing will be impossible with God”

    Then Job answered the Lord and said “I know that You can do all things”

    And looking at them Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

    Eric’s interpretation of God is that he is NOT omnipotent, while these scriptures say otherwise. Me personally, I reject the notion of omnipotence. Clearly, however, The Bible does not.

  28. Michael Sousa September 2, 2010 at 3:20 pm #

    To the non-believers:
    I just have a few questions for all the non-believers of the Bible.
    Why do you expend such time and energy to try and debunk the word of GOD?
    If you have no soul?! What are you worried about? What’s the reason of arguing your point?
    True believers are arguing to try to save your soul!!! What’s your purpose in arguing?
    Is there a good purpose? Or, is it to pet your ego that you are correct?

    Oh…could it be that GOD covicts everyone to know the truth….and your searching for it. Good for you!! Keep it going!!

    Spend more time reading the word of GOD to determine how it affects your life, instead of trying to disprove it!!
    I want your soul in the Kingdom of GOD!!! Amen

  29. Stephen Holshouser September 2, 2010 at 5:20 pm #

    For Jack or Jon,

    Here is the question; If we agree that nothing could logically be omnipotent in the strictest definition (can do all things without exception) btw- I don’t know anyone who believes this about God,

    What word would you use instead of omnipotent to define the God of the Bible who says He is able to all that He wills, but is unable to do the things He does not will? Notice the difference in His actual abilities, which are completely coherent and perfectly logical, and “able to do all things, even creating a rock too big for Him to lift” which IS illogical. See, the Bible never describes Him being able to do things without exception.

    The word Almighty from the Hebrew just means “the most powerful.” Surely, Someone holding the title of “most powerful” doesn’t violate your idea of logic, does it? You should be able to concede this as being sensible if you are really objective and reasonable and not just trying to win the debate regardless of the truth. I look forward to your answer to my question. Thanks, SH

  30. Mike Ayala September 2, 2010 at 8:43 pm #

    Jon Richt September 1st at 7:22 am

    Hey Jon,

    Great to see your post. Just a quick one here: Your implied definition of omnipotence sounds more like the chaos of non-vectored energy, or rather randomness. Hummm… I see the evolutionary connection here. You really prove my earlier point that you worship a god made in your own image based on your own understanding and limitations.

    Jack Napper September 1st at 12:14 pm

    Hi Jack,

    Again, just a quick note:

    I appreciate your effort in your post. I would appreciate it if you do not put words in my mouth. It is very unhygienic, and it is a great source of confusion.

    Nowhere did I say or imply that one ought “To simply accept it because someone says it’s the word of God”. You are shooting at something that does not exist.

    Your baseless “Been done. Find a new argument, response is in typical propaganda form. Such a response is easy to say, but impossible to back up. There has never been anyone to expose error in the Scripture that has stood up to the slightest scrutiny. I’d be interested to see any you might have or can produce. There may be slight copyist errors, but they are all well known and understood. What you are talking about does not exist.

    What usually happens when a skeptic honestly believes the Bible is not the word of God and they honestly seek to disprove it, they find their arguments are without merit, and as they examine the evidence honestly, they become Christians – fired-up Christians who become well-know apologists. Two such folks are Josh McDowell and Frank Morrison. (Note the key word “Honestly”.)

    Now cool your jets on the not providing evidence rant. I simply asked Jay if he was willing to objectively consider the evidence God has provided. You blow your credibility making a fuss over nothing. Are you willing to objectively consider the evidence God has provided?

    Your ignorance of Bible prophecy is apparent. Go to the source, not to heresay. Check it out for yourself, then come back with something intelligent and informed to say about it. A little primary research in the Bible on your part would be helpful.

    andrew Ryan September 2nd at 9:55 am

    Hi Andrew,

    Logic is merely a reflection of God’s nature in His creation.

    Grace and blessings to you all.

    Mike Ayala